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Auto Magx Carbine

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Category: Auto Mag Pistol
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URL: http://www.amtguns.info/forum_posts.asp?TID=798
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Topic: Auto Magx Carbine
Posted By: MAX GERA
Subject: Auto Magx Carbine
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 12:09am
Hi guys,
Here is what I've been working on for the last few months...
First, my new logo:
Sometime last year, there were quite a few posts on Auto Mags with shoulder stocks. One of them was by Conny... After a few posts, I arrived to the conclusion that this was a worthwhile project.
 
The main criteria was to be able to install a shoulder stock without altering the pistol's frame. I worked on the design for a few months before I was satisfied with the concept and here are the results:
 
 I completed two carbines early this week; both with 16.5" barrel (that makes them 100% legal) and I took one to a friend's private range for testing and sighting in. It worked flawlessly and even so that my eyes are not what they used to be, it still managed to shoot a more than satisfactory group at 50 yards:
 
 
I've many more pictures on the file manager, but I don't want to overload the first post.
 
OK Conny, the cat is finally out of the bag!
 
Max


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!



Replies:
Posted By: 7mmMKsuper
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 1:00am
Max,
     BRAVO!  Very nice looking and performing.  Is this a conversion you are willing to do for others as well?

MK



Posted By: 7mmMKsuper
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 2:49am
Max,
    I forgot to ask in the earlier post, does this example include your new Bolt Design?

Again, fantastic work!
MK


Posted By: jw4570
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 3:04am
Oh my God!
 
Awesome.
 
JW


Posted By: Conny
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 6:31am
Gentlemen,
Since I bought my first Auto Mag decades ago, I always wondered why no one built a Carbine in the .44AMP and .357AMP cartridge. A little over a year ago, I mentioned on this site that I would love an Auto Mag Carbine. Well, Max Gera contacted me and said he would build one.
 
The realization that my Carbine would be built by the man who designed the first Auto Mag 40 years ago was an opportunity I couldn't pass up. I sold a few firearms and went without luxury items until paid in full.
 
Being a regular Joe Shmo, never in my wildest dream did I think this would ever be built. I can never thank Max enough for making a decades old dream come true.
 
I am deeply honored and priviledged to not only own this Carbine but, the first one of its kind as well. My firearm collection is small. This Carbine is by far the most valued.
 
Now it's time to get ready for them hogs. Bacon anyone???


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Rangers Lead The Way,

Duane Leiker


Posted By: Luc V.
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 5:21pm
Very good looking work Max!
Reminds me of the old Luger carbine, which I also find beautyfull.Wink
 
 
 
(pic's: http://www.phoenixinvestmentarms.com/966Carbine02W.htm - http://www.phoenixinvestmentarms.com/966Carbine02W.htm )


Posted By: Auto Mag Whisperer
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 5:43pm
See Max, I told you it looked like a Luger carbine too.  Just stunning work my friend.
I look forward to see whats next.  You are like the gift that just keeps on giving.
 
Bruce
 


Posted By: Rumore
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 7:08pm
Nice!!!


Posted By: Yoshi
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 7:18pm
Awesome! Thumbs%20Up
 
Yoshi


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http://www.blackstonear.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.blackstonear.com


Posted By: Gerry
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 8:30pm
Very cool but how does the stock attach to the frame? When will the barrel production begin?
Conny, I like my bacon with three eggs. A very exciting project to enjoy for years to come.
Congrates to both.


Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 10:01pm
Hi 7mmMKsuper,
I intend to make about a dozen kits on a special order basis. It does not yet incorporates the new bolt. If I make the bolts by hand with my current equipment, I would have to charge at least $2,000.00 each. The new bolt will have to wait until I can set up to make at least one hundred units, to bring the price down.
Hi Luc,
The entire design was indeed inspired by the Luger carbine. I  updated the stock design  to a more contemporary and comfortable higher comb.
Hi Gerry,
At first I was going to attach the stock using "Auto Mag Sophisticated Aerospace Technology", you know: welding, crazy glue, a couple of ring clips and maybe a helicoil or two.DeadDeadDead
But then, in consideration to the Luger theme, I decided to use good design and old world gun maker's methods instead.Smile
Here are some pictures of the stock lug:
And here is how it attaches to the frame:
As you can see, the the frame lug is made in two pieces and wraps around the grip frame with two claws holding it to the inside the frame cut-out. The grip-stocks are inletted into the frame for strength and rigidity.
The whole unit is so strong, that I test fired it holding the buttstock against a wall without any problems (many gunstocks will break if you pull that stunt).


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: darrell
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2011 at 10:40pm
Wow!!!  Another work of art Max.  Too Cool. 

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darrello


Posted By: Luc V.
Date Posted: 30 Jul 2011 at 10:55am
Max,
That is a very nice conversion and technique!
I'm just curious about the little black latch under the barrel. Since I'm almost 100% sure that the barrel is not welded but threaded in the frame LOL, you haven't made that a quick change barrel didn't you? As in the old winchesters, quarter turn on the barrel and its out...
Now that would be the most convertible pistol/carbine package...Big%20smile


Posted By: Auto Mag Whisperer
Date Posted: 30 Jul 2011 at 5:03pm
Hey Max,
 
          How about showing us how the fore-stock attaches.  You said you might design in a way to store a magazine in the butt-stock.  Did you do this ?  The wood you chose is beautiful.  What kind is it ?
 
        Lots of questions I know.  This is the most exciting Auto Mag news in many years.  It's a good thing you didn't waste any time with that Kodiak outfit.  Maybe someday you will tell us what happened with them offering you a job.
 
Bruce


Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 30 Jul 2011 at 5:31pm
Luc,
 
I did not go as far as a 1/4 turn takedown system. Nevertheless, the entire conversion can be accomplished in less than five minutes. Here is how the forend is attached:
The forend iron is attached to the frame with a simple pin that replaces the takedown lever. It has two leveling screws that lock it in place against the front of the frame and the trigger guard. The wood is attached to the iron with two screws.
 
Hi Bruce,
 
I did install a trap-door butt plate that holds a magazine and/or other stuff.
 
 I used air dry California Claro at least five years old.
 
As far as "The Auto Mag Company", they wanted me to make five prototypes with all the improvements in different calibers; all at my expense... Then, sign over all rights to them.
All of this without me getting a dime. Then  when they started making guns they would pay me $300.00 per gun sold.
 
I told them that I would consider their offer with a $50,000.00 retainer and $10,000.00 a month while I built the prototypes. I never heard from them again!
 
Tony, it looks like you were asking the same question while I was responding to Luc and Bruce


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: Rumore
Date Posted: 30 Jul 2011 at 5:32pm
How does that forearm attach to the gun?  It looks like it's screwed to the barrel, but with the barrel moving back and forth.........
It looks like the forearm is solidly up against the trigger guard as well.......I'm at a loss here as to how that works.  Maybe we don't have all the right pics or I'm just a dumbass.
 
OK...I have to edit my post now, since Max added pics that weren't posted when I posted the above response.
 
So....the answer is.....we did not have all the pics needed to understand how it was put together.
 
Tony
 
 


Posted By: 7mmMKsuper
Date Posted: 30 Jul 2011 at 5:39pm
Max,
    Very elegant solution.  Thanks for sharing the pictures.

Can't wait to get mine
MK


Posted By: Conny
Date Posted: 30 Jul 2011 at 6:15pm
Bruce,
I hope your statement; "This is the most exciting Auto Mag news in many years.", is true. I think it is.
 
Once I have possesion of the Carbine, I'll send emails and photos to various gun magazines for a possible test firing and article. Might one day see the Auto Mag on the cover of a magazine again. Who knows? Nothing ventured, nothing gained.
 
I wouldn't have my Carbine if Max worked on that Kodiak crap.
 
For my next project; Max, how about a belt fed Auto Mag Carbine?? WinkThumbs%20UpBig%20smile


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Rangers Lead The Way,

Duane Leiker


Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 30 Jul 2011 at 6:43pm
Conny,
 
I think that belt fed stuff is more in the Will Hayden's (Son of Guns) department.
 
Max


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: Ian
Date Posted: 31 Jul 2011 at 7:39pm
That looks stunning :)

Ian



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http://www.amtguns.net" rel="nofollow - Ian's AMT Information Page
http://www.glossover.co.uk" rel="nofollow - A little more about me - My corner of the internet


Posted By: schwammy
Date Posted: 01 Aug 2011 at 2:47am
Oh my! That sir, is a work of art!


Posted By: Road King
Date Posted: 01 Aug 2011 at 5:20pm
Beautiful, insightfully engineered design.  Another example of what can be when skill and creativity come together.  Kudos to you Max.  A gun worthy of the cover of any magazine.  The photos caused my blood pressure and heart rate to go up to unsafe levels.
 
Charlie


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"Whoever said "the pen is mightier than the sword" obviously never encountered automatic weapons."
General Douglas MacArthur.


Posted By: Road King
Date Posted: 01 Aug 2011 at 5:34pm
Max,
You said in your first post you intended to make a dozen sets on a special order basis.  Are you taking deposits?  Do you have a total cost estimate yet?  I'm still trying to get my pulse rate under control and I've started looking for stuff to sell.
Charlie


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"Whoever said "the pen is mightier than the sword" obviously never encountered automatic weapons."
General Douglas MacArthur.


Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 01 Aug 2011 at 7:23pm
Hi Charlie,
 
Most of your questions are answered in my post in the classifieds.
 
Max


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: schwammy
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2011 at 2:14am
I wonder if I can get enough to afford a kit if I sell my cats into slavery...     

(I'm not complaining about the price; for the amount of time and skill you put into each, it is a bargain in my opinion.)


Posted By: Conny
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2011 at 2:25am
I have one and I'm trying to sell my kidney on-line for a "kit" as an investment. The price is quite reasonable.

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Rangers Lead The Way,

Duane Leiker


Posted By: aklawok
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2011 at 3:43am
  That is some wonderful matched furniture max, did you do your own carving?
let me(us) know when and how $ will be available. especialy with your new bolt design.Clap


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WHEN IN NOME, DO AS THE NOMENS!
ITS NOT THE END OF THE WORLD, BUT YOU CAN SEE IT FROM HERE!

73 KL1YJ


Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2011 at 4:00am
Yes Ken, that is my woodwork.
The carbine package is available now... Detail$ in the cla$$ified $ection.
I explained about the bolt availability earlier on this post.
 
Max


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: TC357MAX
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2011 at 3:05am
Max great looking carbine at a good price too!  What kind of loads were you shooting? Will it function at light loads?
Have you thought about making any without sights? How about a scope mount integral to the forearm?


Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 05 Aug 2011 at 5:02pm
The loads used for the tests were 240 gr. FMJ  with  21.2 grains of WW296 and CCI LP primers.
According to Bruce Stark, this load gives 1,250 fps from a 6.5" barrel.
 
I wanted to check the velocity from the 16.5" barrel. Unfortunately, it  kept on raining on and off during the tests and I couldn't set up the chronograph.
I'll try again next time and report the results. I'm hoping for at least an additional 250 fps.
 
Max


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: jw4570
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2011 at 1:15am
I'm curious as well.   The 357 AMP behaved like this with 158gr and 21.5gr 296:
 
6.5"  ~1650 fps
8.5"  1751 fps
14"   1979 fps (Contender Barrel)
 
So I'd guess 14-16" or so is getting to the "diminishing returns" area with pistol powder.
 
Jason


Posted By: curmudgeon
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2011 at 4:02am
296 isn't just a Pistol powder, considered about the slowest for pistols with heavy bullets. Shotgun and small caliber rifle probably use more than pistols.


Posted By: jw4570
Date Posted: 06 Aug 2011 at 4:07pm
As Usual, Lee is correct.
 
I should know better, I use it for 30 carbine too.


Posted By: curmudgeon
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2011 at 7:56am
Yes Jason, with certain pistol powders 14-16" would be deminishing returns, but with 296 in heavy bullets iin 357bAMP it would be somewhere south of 20-22"s. FWIW


Posted By: Auto Mag Whisperer
Date Posted: 20 Aug 2011 at 12:22am
Max, thanks for the pictures of the birds-eye maple blanks. That is some beautiful wood right there. I think I'll have some fillings pulled to come up with the $$$$$. Thank you Maestro.
Bruce


Posted By: 7mmMKsuper
Date Posted: 20 Aug 2011 at 1:33am
Bruce,
     Did you send a blank for your carbine also?  I sent Max a blank to use for mine, (Walnut) and he sent some photos of the layout and it is going to be stunning.  Hope yours comes out as nice.  I know the craftsmanship will be fantastic either way.

MK


Posted By: Auto Mag Whisperer
Date Posted: 20 Aug 2011 at 1:50am
Hi MK.  No, Max has been showing me several types of wood to choose from.  The piece he showed me hadn't been aged enough for him.  Are you going to get the hardwood case to go with it ?............Bruce


Posted By: 7mmMKsuper
Date Posted: 20 Aug 2011 at 2:11am
Bruce,
     I probably should get the case, but have not really given it much thought.  I will check with Max about it, and see what comes of it.

MK



Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 20 Aug 2011 at 3:21am
Hi Mark,
 
I do have a very good picture in mind about the case. And no, it will no have any "Rocket Scientist" foam in it (you know, the kind that eats your gun!).  I've been looking at hardware and I'm not sure yet which way I want to go. Nevertheless, I'm thinking very traditional visible true dovetails, bronze piano hinge and handle and maybe even corners.
 
My idea is to have a case that when you first see it, before you open it, you'd expect to see a pair of dueling pistols in it. And then... surpirse!
I will give it some more serious thought and work out a price after I finish the Carbines that I'm working on now.
 
After all, what good is the best case without a gun in it?
 
Max
 
 


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2011 at 12:53am
Hi Bruce,
 
Here is the curly maple that I just got for you. It's six years old air dried and it will be quite a showpiece.


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: Gerry
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2011 at 1:14am
Very nice wood. I would like to see the finished project for sure.
Gerry


Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2011 at 2:26am
It will be up on the board in about four months. And this one will have a special twist... Right Bruce?Wink

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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: Conny
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2011 at 2:47am
Awe Max, more secrets? I hope I live long enough to see your "special twist" carbine Bruce.

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Rangers Lead The Way,

Duane Leiker


Posted By: Auto Mag Whisperer
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2011 at 3:40am
I think I like the name of that.  The Bruce Carbine.  Don't tell anybody about the "Harry's Revenge" barrel you are going to make.  That might not be the final name, but what a barrel it will be.  Watch for more to come.  Bruce


Posted By: BT Sniper
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2011 at 9:44pm
Wow! Been a while since I have been around. Awesome work! I'll have to cruise the sight see what else is new.
 
Good shooting!
 
BT


Posted By: Road King
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2011 at 10:45pm
Beautiful wood and I love the light color and strong figure.  What a stock that will make......  I'm jealous Bruce.
 
Charlie


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"Whoever said "the pen is mightier than the sword" obviously never encountered automatic weapons."
General Douglas MacArthur.


Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 25 Aug 2011 at 12:28am
Hi Charlie,
 
You don't have to be jealous... I'm working on six carbine sets right now and ONE is still available!Wink
 
Max


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: Auto Mag Whisperer
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2011 at 6:21pm
Hey Max,  is that sixth slot still available ?  I have a Mauser collector friend who would like one of your Carbine Kits.  He would like a plastic laminate that looks like the type of laminate used on the Mauser K98K rifles.  I don't know if anybody even makes the laminate in plastic.
I have heard that you are now taking orders for just barrels.  Do you have a pricing schedule yet ? 
 
Last question.  Would you consider making and selling just the fore-stock for longer barreled Auto Mags ?
 
We are lucky to have you posting here.................Thanks.........................Bruce S.


Posted By: 7mmMKsuper
Date Posted: 01 Oct 2011 at 3:17pm
Hey Max or Conny,
      Have you had an opportunity to send a few round over a chronograph yet?   Any results to share?Big smile

Thanks,
MK


Posted By: Conny
Date Posted: 02 Oct 2011 at 6:03am
MK,
I just picked up my Carbine the 1st of October. I do plan on chronographing the various custom ammo I had made. I'll sling various type of ammo down range but don't have time in the next week to do so. 


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Rangers Lead The Way,

Duane Leiker


Posted By: 7mmMKsuper
Date Posted: 26 Oct 2011 at 12:36am
WOW!
      Here are a couple of photos that show off Natures wonders and Max Gera's craftsmanship.  When I communicated with Max about obtaining one of his Auto MagX Carbines, I asked if he would use a stock blank that I could supply, and he said he would.   Even Though Max had to work around a couple of hidden occlusions, as you can see the results are simply amazing and spectacular.  I could not be more pleased with the appearance so far, and can hardly wait for it to be finished so I can try it out.  I have had that particular blank for four or five years, waiting for the right project, and I think I choose wisely.  Max will be able to get the for-end, and grip panels from the same blank, so all together it will truly be, a sight to see.  I just can not put into words how great it looks to me even at this stage. Big smile  

Thank You Max Gera.


MK




Posted By: tgt40
Date Posted: 26 Oct 2011 at 2:13am
Absolutely beautiful, please keep us informed!


Posted By: Conny
Date Posted: 26 Oct 2011 at 4:04am
7mm,
Stock came out beautiful. I was at Max's place and checked out your stock blank. I should have taken off a sliver so I can say I helped....LOL. 

 I know you'll be pleased with the end result. I sure am.


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Rangers Lead The Way,

Duane Leiker


Posted By: MAX GERA
Date Posted: 27 Oct 2011 at 12:32am
Hi Conny,

Did you get a chance to chronograph yours yet?

Max


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To get things done, stop talking... Start doing!


Posted By: Auto Mag Whisperer
Date Posted: 30 Oct 2011 at 2:22am



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